/meta/ - Suggestions

anyone that uses fedgram is a fucking idiot

>>272 (OP) 
if you're worried, just use a burner number.

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>Burner numbers
Burners are not a thing anymore. All communications between mobile phone network towers are unencrypted and therefore tapped by all governments of all their countries. So as soon as you use that burner once, the location is forever logged and makes it all that much easier for you to be found. Then there was some asshole in another thread saying "Just use a burner, then you can throw the burner away then use telegram on all your devices" are you fucking kidding me? How stupid do you think we all are? If this telegram thing doesn't get resolved, it's pretty clear what Ourchan fucking is a honeypot. I'm going to be so happy watching y'all glowies die. But funny now y'all are just killing yourselves now, blowing up in cybertrucks and suicide yourselves after a bit of fun running your toro rented trucks into crowds. fucking losers. I'm sad that your department-wide drug addictions are running your agents into the ground. There won't be any of you left to fight. So sad. JUST USE CWTCH OR SIMPLEX OR IRC WTF!!!!

>>323
He is correct. The process for getting a clean phone and a clean number is very complicated and will still show where your location is. 2fa is just a way to credential and location dox users. What really woke me up was using TAILS, this supposedly soooper anon system, and it was fucking asking me for my phone number to authenticate to their bridge server. Lol, it's a scam all the way down.

I don't know if these guys are a honeypot. They aren't doing anything terrible other than not shutting down the bulgarian dude who is definitely on a bunch of national lists for the information he is spreading. There's probably one fed hanging around based on the responses to the cop thread but that's about it. I don't know, I still trust this site as a normal user

>>323
You clearly have no concept of how sms verification works there are hundreds of ways to purchase a burner number using monero online without exposing your geo location or imei, I bought mine for $2 about 3 years ago this is clearly bait. Please think before sperging out.

https://kycnot.me/

Once this site matures a bit I look forward to teaching anons proper opsec in /g/ instead of whatever the fuck this shit is

>>325
>tails asking for a phone number
Do I understand you correcting in saying that you were asked to input a phone number for using tor bridges? That is not normal behavior for tails. So it looks like somehow you downloaded a hacked .iso of tails.
Where did you attempt to get your bridges? from bridges.torproject.org? When did you did you see this phone number thing? If you can you should try to recreate the situation, collect evidence and post about it on https://forum.torproject.org/tag/tails Ultimately tails is not 100% Whonix is better. Setup Whonix in RAM only mode. You can learn about it on forum.qubes-os.org

>bulgaria fishing.

I've seen that psyop too. They don't want whites connecting with nationalists in bulgaria lol. Funny how EU is so scared of White nationalists heading to the balkans before their up-and-coming gay war that NATO will unironically lose. And then white nationalists from the balkans will purge the jews from EU liberating Europa once a for all. Of course they have every reason to be scared.

>>326
>Just monero goy, still download the app girl, on all your devices goy, no red black engineering goy, don't worry goy, you won't fuck it up goy. You won't make any sort of critical mistakes goy. Just trust us goy, because I trust us goy
Why would anybody create a WN chan, then subject it's users to such dangerous tech related "dark patterns"? Just deploy a simplex room. Would take 10 minutes. Even a new XMPP or IRC server, 30 minutes max. Why create such a dangerous situation for it's users? You won't be doing anything in /g because you obviously don't know shit kike. For even suggesting anything to do with apps or phones without warning users not to use phones you're showing your true intent. Malevolence, not negligence.

>>328
I never mentioned downloading anything on your phone or using any app, what you are doing is called a straw man. Please take your meds

The reason people use telegram in the first place is to ban spergs like yourself who clearly have never strung together an intelligent thought in their entire lives. I do not endorse and never did endorse centralized, for profit, communication but with proper opsec telegram is more secure than irc and there is no arguing that fact. And before you throw another tantrum I would like to place emphasis on the word secure. Telegrams messages are end to end encrypted using their proprietary bs but irc is plaintext and if not set up right exposes your ip to everyone in the room. It is difficult to setup, difficult to use, and difficult to secure so it is a poor decision and this argument can be made for both xmpp and simplex aswell.

If this is how the average ourchan user behaves im afraid this site won't last very long, mods should implement a tard containment board or just banish retards to /hell/ so they can argue amongst themselves.

>>331
God you're a pretty bad fed. And don't know anything about hosting secure infrastructure. Telegram has already proven that we know nothing of it's backend. The marketing says end to end encrypted, but using that on a device whose other apps can see your screen makes E2E pointless. And for a group chat there is no point in having it encrypted in the first place. So this discussion is not at all about encryption. All it takes is one fag fed like you to join the room and see all the decrypted messages. You can call me a retard, but obviously there are layers here that you can't comprehend because you're a fed. You're all dumb. This debate about not using telegram is about reducing the layers of metadata links. More links, more evidence. More chances to fuck up big time. And telegram being a dark pattern in that it's too easy to fuck up ones anonynmity, even if one does everything correctly. Using some like IRC or XMPP and not being a faggot on Ourchan, users explain to each other how to run these apps in whonix hopefully in Terminal on qubes-os. And NEVER installing the fucking app on one's fun or other devices like a total fucking idiot. What is the goal here? That goal is white nationalists who can speak their minds anonymously so they don't get doxxed, they don't get harassed. 9 times out of 10 we don't get visted by the feds, we get harassed by some paid antifa niggers paid by IDF. It's wild to me how hard this whole chan in every thread is pushing telegram and now calling us retards for having such concerns, and now you're debating semantics in the realm of logical fallacies in typical kike fashion when the topic at hand is TELEGRAM MAKES IT HARDER TO BE ANONYMOUS, IRC AND XMPP MAKES IT EASIER TO STAY ANONYMOUS WITH THE CORRECT SETUP WHICH FRENS HERE WILL HELP FRENS SETUP CORRECTLY. But tldr, just downloads qubes and use a the irc or xmpp client inside whonix. Then you're good to go. You're a fucking piece of shit. I can't wait to see nigger tranny feds dead along with your pajeet horde and kike overlords. 

ALSO to use monero actually anonymously requires training. That's another thing that easy to fuck up. Telegram just adds a bunch of unnessary hurdles. I'm started to get the mind that I should hunt down this stu hizzy and new admin and kill you all personally for trying to run a joke of a honeypot. Is it true they got too busy with thier familiy? keep trying to dox us I'll kill your family too.

>>327
I have it on a flash drive. I am pretty confident I got it from the real site. Glad I never got into using the iso much if that's the case.  Whonix + qubes crash my puter unfortunately. 

As for the rest I just know it's easy to get false positives for what you think are feds.  I didn't say the bulgarian was one of them. I'm saying he's conducing himself poorly but that isn't a sign of a bad site. The line for this content has to be very firm and have a big buffer in my opinion, since people can just be stupid on these sites for the memes and then face consequences.

>>332
everything that is intended for a modern smartphone is fake and gey. I don't think the guy is necessarily malicious, many are simply far behind the curve

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>>272 (OP) 
Brother in Christ, buy some BTC on ATM with cash, transfer the BTC to TON (telegram blockchain) and buy a telegram official e-sim lmao

>>336
Or Session App, I agree I would also rather use irc or session for modern app feel

>>331
> It is difficult to setup, difficult to use, and difficult to secure so it is a poor decision and this argument can be made for both xmpp and simplex aswell.
SimpleX is easy to use for nontechnical users and is very secure out of the box, much more so than any of the other options.

>>337
> Or Session App
Session is no good.

> Perfect Forward Secrecy removed
https://cyberinsider.com/secure-encrypted-messaging-apps/session/


Anything asking for a phone number (such as Telegram) for this kind of activity is a significant and highly unreasonable hurdle. That the admins of this board don't know better is a hard indicator that this website is either to be nothing more than a flash in the pan or a honeypot run by someone very heavily compromised.

>>1700
Session is perfectly fine, I literally know one of the devs.
>But this link I shared
That is a low quality AI shit SEO blog. Save it. You just prefer SimpleX - that's fine, don't sugarcoat it.

>>1701
Talked with them - they advised not to use the project. They also advised using SimpleX because the devs have a history of lying by omission. 
>There is currently no decent secure chat app

>>1702
> Talked with [one of the Session developers] - they advised not to use [Session app]
Thank you for taking the time to follow up on this topic and also for the integrity on your part to provide the updated information. If there are reasons other than lack of Perfect Forward Secrecy, and there likely are, please share them if you are able to.

Anyone interested in encrypted chat should try to be keen on what Perfect Forward Secrecy is and why it is important.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_forward_secrecy

> They also advised using SimpleX because the devs have a history of lying by omission.
Please, if possible, share the details on what the lies by omission were.

> >There is currently no decent secure chat app
Yes, there is no decent secure chat "app".
There are however secure applications of chat. Such are enjoyed by coordinated groups that have discipline with GNU Privacy Guard keys, know how to guard backend instances behind secure gateways using mutual TLS with somewhat manual key management, and have the wherewithal to patiently examine source code releases then also continuously build that source code with internally hosted automated build pipelines.

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>>1701
> That is a low quality AI shit SEO blog
And even the "low quality AI shit SEO blog" knew that Session lacks (and still lacks) Perfect Forward Secrecy, but you did not.

> You just prefer SimpleX - that's fine, don't sugarcoat it.
Yes, the types of people who can read and write both Haskell and TypeScript, who also know what a "formal proof" (this is a math thing) is in the context of programming (real programming, not mere coding), and have IT security backgrounds, do prefer SimpleX.

SimpleX does not lack basic encryption functionality like Perfect Forward Secrecy and does not rely on the Oxen network. Although if someone wanted to they could proxy messages for SimpleX (or anything else) through the Oxen network using Session. Proxying (in addition to other proxying) through the Oxen network is a neat option to have but only as an option (and fundamentally with the option to opt out).
Anyone can run their own SimpleX server and put whatever reverse-proxy in front of that server they please.

Session is a NodeJS app implemented in TypeScript. By contrast, SimpleX is written in Haskell. The SimpleX desktop frontend is written in a Java framework and runs open OpenJDK, which isn't too great, but is appropriate for the use case.

Compared to SimpleX, Session is a toy.

The one major gap SimpleX has is a lack of binary reproducable builds (as in, resulting binaries built on different systems have matching hashes) in addition to the fact that SimpleX binaries are presently built on servers controlled by those niggers at Microsoft (GitHub is owned by Microsoft).
https://reproducible-builds.org/
Aside from this gap, which any real programmer can close if they choose to do that work, SimpleX is out-of-the-box secure and results in the very least amount of metadata exposure for clueless users.

Admittedly, there are three very significant things I would like to see added to SimpleX that would render hopeless adversaries' efforts against SimpleX users. But, even without those enhancements, SimpleX is the closest thing to a decent secure chat app today given all of the information that we do have.

SimpleX users who build the source code in a virtual machine that is gated by an upstream Whonix VM and also proactively check safety numbers do today present a significant challenge for adversaries.

Unlike with Telegram, small groups with SimpleX remain anonymous and encrypted.

>>1703
You're welcome fren. I strive for objectivity and I'm not afraid to admit when I'm wrong. Around the time they removed PFS there were changes to the team behind Sess. I no longer trust the Oxen team - do with this information what you will. I'll contact the dev and get back to you on more details regarding SimpleX. 
>re. "app." vs secure applications of chat
Yes, but if you want mass adoption you're looking for something self contained into an application, more less. A lot of what you're saying will fly over normalniggers heads - is that a bad thing? No, but I also understand why the staff use telegram. If you want the average user of this website to be able to chat with the mods you gotta make it simple. Even IRC would cockblock 75% of people (lmao).
>>1704
>Typescript
Not impressed
>Haskell
Used by people who just want to say they use haskell. I've never met a serious programmer who uses haskell. Case in point: you're literally only bringing it up to show off.

basically everyone who uses telegram is a retard. But I wouldn't assume malice to misplaced trust

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>>1705
> If you want the average user of this website to be able to chat with the mods you gotta make it simple.
SimpleX as an app is simple enough for normalniggers to use and does not have the highly unreasonable burden of asking for a phone number.
The end-to-end encryption used by SimpleX is always enabled, and not merely optionally enabled and not also highly questionable like Telegram's is.

> never met a serious programmer who uses haskell
All of pandoc is written in Haskell.

> Used by people who just want to say they use haskell.
Haskell is used by people who want the merits of Haskell. The merits of Haskell where fallen on ears of the math-illiterate, fall on deaf ears. The ultimate concern of the larger discussion above is safety, hence the inherent safety of Haskell (for which Haskell is rightly famous for) over other languages is relevant. SimpleX, written in Haskell, benefits from that safety.
Personally, I would prefer that SimpleX be implemented in Ferrous Systems' specification of Rust, and then some enhancements in addition to that including DAGs and transpiling that codebase to an implementation of formal proofs (mathematically true code). This has already been done for quantum-resistant end-to-end encryption used with the Matrix protocol. There is another language built on top of Haskell that may also be a good fit and may be a better choice. Rust does have a lot of build provenance baggage. The provenance baggage Rust has is some work waiting to be done. This other language could be ported to something else (maybe Rust).

> only bringing it up to show off
It appears my superiority has led to some controversy.

Use Wire.